Well, in my own opinion, definitely yes. And I will now present my reasoning.

The island of Taiwan has always been occupied by China since the 1700's, except for a time when Japan took over during the 1900's.

When the Nationalists were defeated by the communists in 1949, the Nationalists stole all the gold in the treasury, took everything possibly of value (including works of art and priceless relics) and fled to the island of Taiwan.

Now the communists was just about to chase after them because of all the atrocities Chiang Kai-shek committed to the communists in his purges in the 1930's, where thousands of communist sympathizers were tortured and murdered. But in came the USA. Under the Truman Doctrine, they felt obliged to protect the Nationalists', even though they were extremely corrupt and had a wide trail of human rights abuses.

So under the comfortable umbrella of American protection, the Nationalists felt safe enough to abuse their rather fragile position. Lucky for them China sank into a period of insanity in the 1950's until the 1970's.

You see, if the US decided at any time to withdraw their protection and acknowledge the communist government as the true power in China (which they did not do until the 1970's for political reasons), the Nationalists would be bombed into the next century and Taiwan rightfully become part of China again. But due to the US protection, Taiwan laughed and talked about declaring independence.

Declaring independence would no doubt will bring the full wrath of China down upon Taiwan, because China obviously knows that the US would not sacrifice millions of American lives over a measly little island in Asia. China is an acknowledged nuclear power if multiple warhead ICBM strike capabilities.

Now, why do I believe Taiwan belongs to China? Because the Nationalists were defeated fair and square despite the help they received from America and they fled to Taiwan, knowing the US would protect their sorry asses.

They left a wide trail of corruption, torture and murder behind them. Once they got to Taiwan they continued that policy on the natives of Taiwan, forbidding them to speak their native langauge and forcing them to speak Mandarin or suffer severe punishment.

The Nationalist Party still exists because of the whim of the American government. Right now, the US owns Taiwan. Not the Taiwanese government. As soon as the US withdraws their umbrella of protection, China will return to reclaim what is rightfully theirs.

China has been in strife for the past one thousand years. The Chinese people are one. Why continue fighting for some outdated ideological rivalry? Make peace already. Thank you.

Response 1:

There is no peace right now. The communist government is still technically in a state of war between the Nationalists, much as North Korea and South Korea are.

And no, they didn't just start wanting it now. They wanted it in 1949, just as they do now. It is about claiming what was yours and was stolen. Taiwan was a barren island. They protected it for political reasons, just as they do now. Taiwan could be a wasteland and China would still want it back.

Response 2: The Americans started the rebellion. The corrupt Nationalists were the people in power originally, the communists were the rebels. The communists seized control of China and the Nationalists stole a part of China so they can preserve the nominal ownership of China under US protection. Big difference to the American Revolution. This isn't a rebellion because they didn't rebel. They merely stole a piece of land from the rightful owners of that land and deluded themselves into thinking that they still ruled China. Simple as that.

Response 3: The corruption of the communist government is beside the point, in truth, they were quite clean until the late 1960's. And about the right to exercise defiance to "hostile rule", yes that right can be exercised.

Taiwan does not have the power to stop it. The USA does. The voters would have voted differently if the US protection umbrella wasn't so certain. The Nationalist government's existence in Taiwan is based on one assumption. That China is afraid to take on the US. As long as that is true, Taiwan can act big and declare anything. The truth is, Taiwan is largely financially dependent on China, and by declaring independence, they have crossed the line. The US would be unwillingly commit to the conflict if that happens, and China would take Taiwan.

Taiwan is too cocky anyways. Never liked them.

Response 4: No, America would not back Taiwan in the case of independence. They wouldn't dare because China would immediately advance to take Taiwan, and the US would not dare to intervene this time because China is not a little country like Yugoslavia. Besides, there is too much trade going on right now and the pro-China members of Congress would stop any action.

Don't say there are strong nativist setiments in Taiwan. Natives there don't forget that the Nationalists slaughtered them by the dozen not too long ago.

And no, if China invaded, it would spank Taiwan. The Chinese navy is a heck of a lot better than you might think, and Taiwan has no air force. It would be a quick and crushing blow, not a protracted war.

Those last few sentences really don't mesh with the rest of your points. If you are so much for peace, why arent you suggesting the Chinese just forget about Taiwan and let the bastards declare independence? The fact is, the Chinese had no intentions towards Taiwan originally because it was as poorly off as China itself. It was completely insignificant, economically and politically. They were perfectly willing to let the nationalists rot in squalor on their little island.

The reason they want it all of a sudden is that Taiwan has become a newly industrialized country, with a strong semiconductor industry and powerful trading partners. If this were about revenge on the nationalists, mainland China could have crushed them long ago. Clamoring for vengeance 50 years later, when you haven't acted on it earlier, just makes you look like a lunatic.

The US started off protecting Taiwan because they backed the nationalists. The only real reason we continue to do so is the same reason the Chinese want the island. By providing military protection, we are placed in a position to demand any trade concessions we wish, while also keeping trade routes for valuable semiconductors open (something that is by no means assured if China were to take over).

Dad took in a refugee Mr Loo, from Red China who cooked wonderful meals for us , I loved him with all my little-girl heart. Frenziedly running over to shut off the radio when the Chinese National Anthem played, I saw the cold sweat on Mr. Loo's face. One can appreciate the irony he must have felt serving a luncheon in our home for Madam Chiang Kai-Shek.
(From his reaction one truly expected horns to be growing out of her head, but she was very nice.)

My sister and I befriended two girls named Ola and Tanya. They lived behind us in the Little American Village, Looking back, the man and woman they lived with ...he was a retired General (Taiwanese?) with a wooden leg, his wife dished out pickled watermelon rinds and candy similar to the white rabbit candy of today. Tanya and I would walk home through rice paddies where water buffalo slowly plodded across the humid fields, chewing salted seeds from a small store (more like a shack) we stopped at on the way home from the Taipei American School

After declassification, my father told us that these two girls were the children of the Dalai Lama . They were sheltered there under the protection of the US Government after escaping the Chinese occupation of Tibet.

These are childhood memories from that time. We were pretty oblivious, as young children are, of the immense history that was going on at the time.

We were taught in school there that Taiwan was neutral and independent of China at the time.

Oh my!! I think I'm in the middle of a political debate!

Well, in my own opinion, definitely no. And I will now present my reasoning.

The colonies of America have always been occupied by Britain since the 1600's.

When the Americans were defeated by the British in New England and New York in the mid-1770s, the Americans stole all the ammo and money they could and fled to Philadelphia.

Now the British were just about to chase after them because of all the atrocities the rebels committed to the Loyalists in the 1770's, when thousands of British sympathizers were robbed and tortured. But in came France. They felt obliged to protect the colonies, even though they were extremely corrupt and had a wide trail of human rights abuses.

So under the comfortable umbrella of French protection, the Americans felt safe enough to abuse their rather fragile position. Lucky for them Britain sank into a period of insanity in the 1780's.

You see, if France decided at any time to withdraw their protection and acknowledge the British government as the true power in America, the Americans would have been bayoneted into the next century and America rightfully become part of Britain again. But due to the French protection, America laughed and talked about declaring independence.

Now, why do I believe Taiwan doesn't belong to China? Because most people there don't want to be part of China. (See their last election?)

Yes, China couldn't keep Taiwan because of the US. But Britain couldn't keep America because of France. Sometimes rebellions succeed; sometimes they fail (Civil War). When they fail, they fail. If they succeed because of outside forces, that's just tough shit for the old ruler, eh? The powerful side wins wars, like it or not, and it's America's policy to back democracies and not communism. Sorry.

Response to DMan: The corrupt Nationalists were the people in power originally, the (also corrupt, funny you never mention that) communists were the rebels. "Stealing" a piece of land, however, is quite rebellious against the newgovernment, eh? Surely at this point in time, after 50 years of control, the mainland China government is no longer a "rebel faction", whereas the offshore "rebel province" is. Sure it's a diferent situation than America, but it's the same idea. When people don't want to be ruled by their government, and have the power to stop that rule, why shouldn't they exercise it?

Besides, was it really "stealing" the land, or just retaining their power there?

Response(*sigh* again):As for the fact that the election results would be different if the US protection weren't there, do you really think that voting out of fear is how democracy should work? The US protection gave them the ability to vote how they wanted to.

Your entire argument really boils down to:
"Taiwan is too cocky anyways. Never liked them."

Things would be simple if it was just Taiwan wanting to be independent, but that's not it.

The Chinese think that Taiwan is a rebel province they need to get under control, but the Taiwan government thinks it should be the ruling government of China. The United States and the United Nations would not even recognize communist China until Richard Nixon went over there and worked things out. This caused Taiwan to be booted off the Security Council and the 1 billion people of mainland China finally got a voice in the U.N.

Sure, things have changed over the last 50 years but this is the basis of the conflict; two groups wanting to control the same place.

I'd be happy if Taiwan would just declare independence. Then we (the US) could officially support them (they'd be a democracy under siege by Communist oppressors) and maybe we'd get some deals on importing all of their computer products.

But it's none of my business...

China only wants Taiwan because Taiwan has become more successful and prosperous than China. China wants this prosperity, and rather than becoming a democratic nation, they turn to the only thing they know... threatening the small island with military force, in the hope that Taiwan will give in. But without a democratic government and basic human rights, Taiwan will not continue to prosper as it has, and China's plan to grasp the island's prosperity will backfire. If China wants to prosper as Taiwan has, they need to follow the example of Taiwan, not smother them with Communism.

China knows that democracy will lead to prosperity, that's why they've allowed Hong Kong to continue to operate with more freedom than the mainland. Just take a look at the Chinese stock market since the aquisition of Hong Kong. The problem is that the leaders are afraid of losing control, and if people could vote, they could vote the current leadership out. But if they move China toward true democracy and prosperity (earned, not obtained), they will be remembered as great men.

In Response to maggie: "The life of America is heavier than that of Taiwanese in the eyes of American government."

It's not life that concerns the US, it's money.  We sent troops to Kuwait quickly because there's oilthere.  But then we took years to decide whether it was justified to send troops to stop the ethnic cleansing in Kosovo.

Right now, China is starting to open their market to the US, so it's no surprise that there was very little US political reaction to China's threats before Taiwan's 2000 elections.  Taiwan has the better economy, but China has a huge potential if they're serious about free trade. That's a tough call for a government that believes only in the almighty dollar.

DMan, how are you qualified to make those statements? I get the feeling you aren't even remotely Chinese, and I get the feeling you don't have a lot of personal exposure or study of the China/Taiwan situation. There are millions of Chinese on both sides of the fence, and they have studied this a lot more than you. I think you are being a little arrogant in your assertions. Especially your "Taiwan is too cocky anyways. Never liked them. " Addendum: Okay, I stand corrected. It seems I am very wrong in my conjectures, but having read some of your other nodes, I find that I don't value your opinion much more.

Now, I'm not Chinese myself, but I have lived in Taiwan for ten years and naturally heard a LOT about this. Let me state the obvious:

• Taiwan is predominantly Chinese, and the Chinese do have a strong sense of cultural unity.
• Taiwan is politically and economically severed from China. It has been since before the Japanese occupation. That's just reality, no matter what the mainland says. Certainly the mainland's posturing has an enormous effect on local politics, however.
• Taiwan does have a culture and</